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Replacement Players
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bockman



Joined: 22 May 06
Posts: 28


PostPosted: Mon Nov 06, 2006 8:42 pm    Post subject: Replacement Players Reply with quote

It would be nice to allow a game to take on a replacement player if one (or more) player does not take a move for a specified amount of time (2 months?).

What does everyone think? Would that work in some instances? I know I would be willing to step into a game to help finish it off for others.

I'd like to hear other's thoughts.
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HappyProle
SBW Developer


Joined: 28 Oct 05
Posts: 409

Location: Salt Lake City, UT

PostPosted: Mon Nov 06, 2006 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We've been bouncing some ideas around about the best way to implement this.

I think the key question is how do you determine when a player is dead; two options we've discussed:

1) After a set time period of inactivity, players are eligible to be replaced.

2) On a case by case basis, admins or other moderators could handle requests to kick players from games.

In either case the games would then show up on a "Games Needing Replacements" page.
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mastapoohba



Joined: 10 Apr 06
Posts: 3


PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 2:26 pm    Post subject: Great idea lets implement it. Reply with quote

I think after 2 weeks of inactivity the player should automatically be able to be replaced. (move the game to the games needing replacements page)
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striking_cobra



Joined: 07 Dec 05
Posts: 107

Location: Gloucester, UK

PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 2:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Great idea lets implement it. Reply with quote

mastapoohba wrote:
I think after 2 weeks of inactivity the player should automatically be able to be replaced. (move the game to the games needing replacements page)


Do you not have a holiday? Two weeks isn't very long at all!
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Kanga



Joined: 27 Oct 05
Posts: 1503

Location: Moe, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HappyProle wrote:
We've been bouncing some ideas around about the best way to implement this.

I think the key question is how do you determine when a player is dead; two options we've discussed:

1) After a set time period of inactivity, players are eligible to be replaced.

2) On a case by case basis, admins or other moderators could handle requests to kick players from games.

In either case the games would then show up on a "Games Needing Replacements" page.


This is a long needed feature for this site. If the workload isn't too great, I'd suggest number 2. I dont think there would be much work after the initial clearout.

As for how long, I'd lean for 1 month. If a player hasn't moved in 1 month, they deserve to be replaced. I have had 1 instance of a player returning after a longer absence, but 1 month strikes a balance between allowing players time to return, and keeping games moving.


How soon can we have this implemented? Smile
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scirub



Joined: 05 Oct 06
Posts: 2

Location: Upstate New York

PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about allowing setting a time limit at the initialization of each game, so that everybody agrees to a specific wait period. No surprises then.
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HappyProle
SBW Developer


Joined: 28 Oct 05
Posts: 409

Location: Salt Lake City, UT

PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whatever the time limit, it would have to ignore "on vacation" time in its calculations. I realize this wouldn't get rid of those cases where someone uses the vacation feature to sit idle in some games while playing in others... but if we implement an automatic 2-week timeout (for example), that makes it very easy to step in and manually inactivate someone.

I think 2 weeks of non-vacation time would be entirely reasonable. I'm trying to imagine a case where someone would feel terribly put out if they got replaced in a game they hadn't bothered to look at it in two weeks.

Next question: should the active players in the game have any say in approving the replacement player?
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Kanga



Joined: 27 Oct 05
Posts: 1503

Location: Moe, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HappyProle wrote:
Whatever the time limit, it would have to ignore "on vacation" time in its calculations. I realize this wouldn't get rid of those cases where someone uses the vacation feature to sit idle in some games while playing in others... but if we implement an automatic 2-week timeout (for example), that makes it very easy to step in and manually inactivate someone.

I think 2 weeks of non-vacation time would be entirely reasonable. I'm trying to imagine a case where someone would feel terribly put out if they got replaced in a game they hadn't bothered to look at it in two weeks.

Next question: should the active players in the game have any say in approving the replacement player?


I disagree about the vacation time. If I was in a game, and took off for a months vacation, I'd have no objections to being replaced. Make it 6 weeks if it makes everyone more comfortable. There are rumours of player(s) abusing vacation time, let's make sure it can't happen.

I suppose that is another argument for having moderator involvement on an individual case basis.

As for replacement players, the game creator should probably choose whether it is a passworded spot or open to anyone.

The final point to think of is should a replacement player have the game counted in his or her statistics? I'd lean towards no; perhaps in profiles you could add an extra spot for number of games joined as a substitute (to show what a nice person you are, helping out the poor players whose game is stuck).
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Kanga



Joined: 27 Oct 05
Posts: 1503

Location: Moe, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The other problem about saying 2 weeks of non vacation time is that is assuming a player 1) knows about vacation time and 2) had a chance to use it. There are times when you get unexpectedly cut off from internet access; it would be nice not to be kicked out of games in 2 weeks in these circumstances. By 1 month, the chances are much higher the player is never coming back.
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freduk



Joined: 18 Jan 06
Posts: 433

Location: Bristol, UK

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The other problem about saying 2 weeks of non vacation time is that is assuming a player 1) knows about vacation time and 2) had a chance to use it. There are times when you get unexpectedly cut off from internet access; it would be nice not to be kicked out of games in 2 weeks in these circumstances. By 1 month, the chances are much higher the player is never coming back.

I half-agree, but the bigger half of me thinks that if you've been unexpectedly cut off from the internet, and 2 weeks later you still haven't got it back, who knows when you will? I'd favour thinking in terms of the remaining players and getting their game back on the road.
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gische



Joined: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 186

Location: San Carlos, CA

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I half-agree, but the bigger half of me thinks that if you've been unexpectedly cut off from the internet, and 2 weeks later you still haven't got it back, who knows when you will? I'd favour thinking in terms of the remaining players and getting their game back on the road.


Exactly. Does anyone here think that it's such a big deal to find out that you have been replaced in a game that you were unable to touch for two weeks? We're not discussing anything punitive, just replacing a player so that the game can continue.
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stargate



Joined: 09 Dec 04
Posts: 603

Location: North Attleboro, Ma USA

PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

most important is to have a system for replacement players
and I think we would all like it sooner rather than later

you could start with a longer time --say 6 weeks
see how the systems works, make any needed tweaks

as time goes on squeeze the "no turn taken" window down to
4 weeks and if required a shorter time

a 6 week window for a replacement player is much better
than the 3-4 month delay to get an abandoned game off your
current games list
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shizzane



Joined: 02 Aug 06
Posts: 61

Location: Dallas, TX

PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I prefer the shorter window. 2 weeks is plenty for the losers. Cool But anything is better than waiting months for it to be cleaned out.

I think the method for determining the replacement player should be either:
A) Decided by the game creator or
B) Automatically set to be an open game if it was created that way or a passworded game it was created that way. If it's a passworded game, most likely the creator wants someone he/she knows or is familiar with.

Just my 2 pennies...
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HappyProle
SBW Developer


Joined: 28 Oct 05
Posts: 409

Location: Salt Lake City, UT

PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

shizzane wrote:
I prefer the shorter window. 2 weeks is plenty for the losers. Cool But anything is better than waiting months for it to be cleaned out.

I think the method for determining the replacement player should be either:
A) Decided by the game creator or
B) Automatically set to be an open game if it was created that way or a passworded game it was created that way. If it's a passworded game, most likely the creator wants someone he/she knows or is familiar with.

Just my 2 pennies...


I think a combination of these two options is what I'm leaning toward. Set a system wide timeout, say 1-2 weeks of it sitting one one person's turn, after which point the game creator would have the option to kick that person out of their game. (If it's the game creator that is absent then I would pass that option on to the next player who joined or an admin)

I probably would just ignore the vacation setting and leave that at the discretion of the game creator -- otherwise it will get abused by fake vacationers.

The password/open state of the game wouldn't change and it would show up on a new page "Games Waiting for Replacement Players."
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Bkruppa



Joined: 08 Nov 05
Posts: 241

Location: Fremont, Ca, USA

PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would this guarantee me getting vacation time from my job?
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